Are City Officials Racist?
Please click onto the title of this post for a story on City contracting and racial disparities.
posted by Bob at Friday, December 08, 2006
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Friday, December 08, 2006
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30 Comments:
What I don't like about local politics is the City hands out a little cash to some of the black community leaders for this or that project and it silences their months on just about evey issue of real concern. These black leaders are just as guilty for not giving their community the leadership it needs!
There is only one color of racism in St. Paul. GREEN (money) you don't have it get the fuck out of Town.
How could anyone think there is not a racial problem in St. Paul? The Fire Department sues them regularly over racial problems, all kinds of landlords sue them for race releated things, they fire their own guy for complaining that the city doesn't follow its own rules with the minority contracting deal, for years the city has resisted doing this so called study or audit, and there hasn't been any kind of investigations refarding any of the above. The city leaders apparantly feel so comfortable with the current state of affairs, they haven't even attemped to do a "sham" investigation. I think what we are seeing is a white city council who refuses to acknowlege the changing demographics of the city and want to keep the status quo" they have had in the past.
Hi All,
I think we need people like Jerry Blakey and Lucky (Tiger Jacks Son) on the City Counsel.
I intend to talk to these men and see if I can't get them to run for the Counsel.
I want you advocates to know I have been in touch with a canidate for the next Mayoral race. This man is popular and is sympathetic to our cause.
I will be endorsing him when the time comes.
There isn't any balck community leaders, just a bunch of non profits and advocates who routinley show that their only interest is promoting their own self interest with racially devisive issues. When it comes time for any of these self serving idiots to stand up and take a stand, they are nowhere to be found. Anyone who has ever been to housing court will tell you there are more housing advocated and Attorneys there pretending to want to help people than there are renters being evcited, yet where have any one of them been during the last year when this property rights debate has been going on? I'll tell you where they have been.....they are laying low because because solving the problem doesn't get them any funding, it puts them out of business and out of a job.
If you could ever get past the conveiniently used "racial divisiveness" aspect of all these issues at the City and in the Community, you might start to get at some real answers.
Apologies to those sick of hearing this, but we need open and honest dialog.
If people, especially White people, can't recognize "White" priviledge and admit that we do have a problem with institutional racism in this town, state, NATION, then we need to get them there.
For years these complex and divisive issues have crippled our community. This needs to be about race and honesty and dealing with the REAL issues.
I think we need to bring people to the table and I for one would like to facilitate.
My vision would be to form a group of community folks, government folks and business people to confront these issue in open and honest dialog.
You want solutions, we need to get at the underlying issues. We need to be ready to openly and honestly admit that these are issues in our community and our world and we need to do that with eachother.
Martin Owings
PS. Thank you to Bob for his kindness in adding a link to my art on the blog, many thanks.
If you could ever get past the conveiniently used "racial divisiveness" aspect of all these issues at the City and in the Community, you might start to get at some real answers.
Apologies to those sick of hearing this, but we need open and honest dialog.
If people, especially White people, can't recognize "White" priviledge and admit that we do have a problem with institutional racism in this town, state, NATION, then we need to get them there.
For years these complex and divisive issues have crippled our community. This needs to be about race and honesty and dealing with the REAL issues.
I think we need to bring people to the table and I for one would like to facilitate.
My vision would be to form a group of community folks, government folks and business people to confront these issue in open and honest dialog.
You want solutions, we need to get at the underlying issues. We need to be ready to openly and honestly admit that these are issues in our community and our world and we need to do that with eachother.
Martin Owings
PS. Thank you to Bob for his kindness in adding a link to my art on the blog, many thanks.
With all due respect Martin, go fuck yourself. People are sick and tired of talking. The black people have been trying to talk for decades, no one would listen. When Rodeney King finally came to light people had the thought that maybe now people will finally start to wake up and realize that a lot of these things do happen, and it happens with the knowing consent and approval of governmnet.
The city has been using the tactics described by the landlords in the federal lawsuits for decades, and the only thing that stopped it was the threat of the Tenants Union lawsuit. When the Tenants Union went belly up, the city goes right back to the same old crap.
The landlords in the lawsuit tried to talk to NHPI and all they got was stabbed in the back.
SPARL hosted a meeting to talk to mayor Kelly and councilman Benanav. What they got was Kelly pointing his finger at them and telling them they would comply and Benanav saying he didn't think the city could be agressive enough with landlords.
That sounds like a good way to open a dialog.
That McDonald guy got fired from his job because he tried to expose the minority contractor situation and wanted to start people talking.
People started talking then, but all it turned out to be was a sham to find an excuse not to do the audit or investigation that they are now claiming they will do. The newspaper reported they did not want to do the investigation because they feared it would provide evidence for the lawsuit.
There have been repeated racial issues with the fire department that have wound up in court and costed the taxpayers a lot of money because the city did not want to talk when they should have. They were more interested in protecting their own!
Beofre the landlords ever filed the federal lawsuit, their attorney set up a meeting with the city attorneys office to talk about this. That meeting was canceled by the city attorney.....they didn't want to talk, and they should have. It could have been settled for a whole lot less back then than 4 lawusits later.
Then there was the e-democracy ordeal....who wanted to talk there? Everyone was run off and silenced, and for the pete sake the originator of this blog even had threats nailed to the door of his home......at a time when the do gooders at e democracy were crying foul about anonymous posters and trying to get people to reveal their identiy. That was going on at a time when we had the flavor of a mayors office who routinley retaliated against people he they didn't agree with.
And then there was the phoney ad-hoc committee that was put together with a bunch self serving city officials and their brown noser wannabe types.
They were gonna talk too.
When they realized they were going to have to deal with the issue of the city using the housing code to deal with behavior issues, they promptly found a soloution to a problem that had not yet been defined or discussed and adjorned the committee.
How much do you wanna bet that this audit or ivestigation or whatever it is with the minority contractors will be anohter whitewash job? Even if it's not, who do you think is going to believe it?...other than you and your e democracy buddies of course.
Now we have aother mayors office who is more of the same.
And where are all the advocates of housing and tenants Martin? When have you seen them say anything other than to bash some landlords fro their own self serving purposes?
I remember the white privlege subject at e democracy, and the only time anyone wanted to talk was when they could first try and destroy the business of a person said to have made a racial slur and the guy wasn't even there, and then to try and picket and destroy the business of another guy who supposedly did make the remark.
When someone exposes what has really been going on with the housing - tenant- corruption affair, and now that it appears the landlords are going to kick the cities ass and the city cannot get out of it, all of a sudden people like you come of the woodwork and wanna have a nice little talk.
The time for talking has long passed my friend. Who would anyone trust enough to sit down and have a honest conversation with anyways?
The city council? The crooked police department who assigns cops to help carry out the corrupt inspection practices?....all the while complaining they don't have enough cops! The new Mayor who is just serving up more of the same? Or maybe the non profits and advocate who make their money off the problems and misery of the poor? How about the county Attorney who routinly goes into court and misrepresents the law and the facts, and the ramsey county court who lets them get away with it? Are those the people that you want to talk to Martin?
I agree with Martin some. We have to start somewhere. I don't think the current people who have been in the political arena have what it takes or the desire to make change.
The current leaders are a bunch of nothing with no heart or soul.
Don't believe it?
Watch em live on cable. The only time they come accross as sincere and saying anything fron the heart is when they get the chance to punish or destroy someone, or their property.
Kathy Lantry and Lee Helgen were so angry that they couldn't take away that black bar owners license that they passs a new law that makes sure they get their way next time. They will have Divas bar closed before the end of the winter, watch and see. If Divas don't violate any rules, the city will just set them up, just like they did to Reaneys bar on Payne Ave.
Who can have any type of respect for the current City COuncil? Lantry takes it over like some kind of communist plot. They throw Bostrom out like a piece of trash, and he has so little self respect for himself, he stays around to have his nose up whoevers ass he can find just so he can have the percieved power and phoney prestiege he thinks he has with rest of them who seem to be dictated to by Lantry. This woman is just an airhead, but yet the rest of the Council seems afraid of her. I wonder what she has on them?
Hi All,
Here is something I see often. I'm driving down the street and I pull up in front of a house. Standing on the steps and sitting on the porch is these gang bang looking types with their baseball hat turned sideways.Their pants hanging down so you can see their undies. Shirts so baggy they could be carrying a shotgun.BLack guys, white guys and Mexicans, all dressed like some Rapper. In fact they are usally Rapping some God for saken lyrics.
Scary huh!
NOT for me. This is my son and his friends. Waiting on my door step to visit me.My son is Saint Pauls youngest black business man. His friends either work for him or have their own jobs or still go to school.He doesn't dress like this at work. This is a fad in clothing. Not all kids who dress the urban dress are gang bangers.
This is the kind of thing though that gives bigoted people the wrong impression. It starts controversy with fearful neighbors and their willingness to help the City rid the neighborhood of a certain class of people because of the way they dress or get together for social exchange.
Now imagine this. Next door to my house is a group of boys of the same age only white and dressed in straight leg jeans and flannel shirts, with butch hair cuts. Does this seem like a trusting group of boys? Well there not. That was me and my friends when I was a kid. We were the guys you didn't want to go out with your daughter or sister.
What I am getting at is racism plays a big role in the issues of property rights here in Saint Paul.
Martin is right we need a local & national discussion on issues of race.
You can't judge a book by it's cover. I know a fella who wears worn out shoes and bib overhauls. Drives rusted junk. He's worth over 8 million dollars.
Unfortunatly, EVERYTHING is judged on looks. Most people learn very early on that if you want to play in the game, you play by the rules. You don't bring a football to a baseball game, and you don't bring gang banger clothes to a sucessful life style. You wanna look like a gang banger, you're gonna get treated like one, and naturally people are not going to like you right off the bat. They are going to be afraid because the only quality you have to put forward is your appearance. People are not stupid, if you are looking gang banger, people think you must aspire to that kind of life and they are going to steer clear of you.
That includes the Police. After years of expierience, their intuition tells them that the people who look like gang bangers are usually not good people and that is going to be their intitial approach with you.
This is a little bit off the subject, but the substance is the same. A while back they had a story on one of those 20/20 type shows and they had a woman that was a knock out for looks go out and stand on the street corner trying to get some help for a flat tire or something. People were tripping over themselves to help. The she put on some over sized clothes and stuffed them with whatever to make herself look fat nad no one would give her the time of day!
If you don't care about your looks and you want to be aprt of a "counter culture", get ready for a bad life.....one of your choosing. Is it worth it to make a statement? Seems to me there are a lot of other wqays to make statements!
To answer your question, yes they are racist.
Hi All,
I must remind everyone that the most henious crimes that have ever occurred in this state were not committed by someone wearing the Urban Clothing Fad.
They were average dressed white people on Meth that went out and maimed and dismembered people. It's happened over and over in this state.
I think the police should be staring down and harrassing your average white person.
Hi All,
I better weigh in here. I tell my son all the time that he shouldn't dress that urban look. He and his friends are only concerned with what their peers think.
As far as this type of dress relate to criminal behavior.Criminals wear all types of clothing. It has even been reported some have been caught wearing no cloths. :-)
The urban clothing market is well into the billion dollar range
and if all these people who are into this clothing fad were criminals I think we would have the National Guard defending our streets right now.
I have to agree with 12:13 to some extent. It's not much different than the Hells Angels wearing their colours to make a statement.
And if I recall, the Angels won the right in federal court to wear their colours anytime they choose.
Here in Saint Paul there was a City Ordinance I believe prohibiting bikers from wearing colours.This ordinance is disregarded by the Hells Angels. (COLOURS- a jean vest with cut off sleeves describing what bike organization a member belongs to.)
So, do we try and illegalize urban dress?
This stuff intrigues me.
The REAL GANG BANGERS, like to drive old police cruisers, they wear DIXIES, the same cloths provided in jail. And, I've seen some sucking suckers. Whats this tell folks?
I think they are yelling loud and clear that the system has become their parents because they have none at home. Strangely, when the courts sentence one of these guys they have some security in knowing someone cares enough to punish them to correct their behavior. So they emulate the system that transports and clothed them.
I know I'm crazy!Anyone ever try to understand why these guys like old police cruisers and jail cloths?
Actually the police shouldn't be needlessly harrassing anyone for the way they dress. It's illegal!
The first thing I think of when I see someone dressed like that is that they come from the ghetto.
I don't care what color these kids and young adults are, the one that wear urban cloths scare me.
Hi All,
In my earlier post referring to urban dress, I was trying to draw a stereo type for everyone.
I want people to think about this. If you have neighbors who dress in urban dress don't jump to the conclusion they are bad or trouble makers. They actually maybe a student, a young business man, or just an honest Joe, you just DON"T know.
The most dangerous men I have ever met in my life have 3 pc. suits on!
I have been on the darkest side of life so I can attest to this.
So if you have a neighbor that wears the urban cloths. Don't be fearful. Reach out to these people. get to know them before you run to the City with your complaints of gangs hanging out at the neighbors house.
Believe it or not this is were a lot of these housing issues start. With a neighbor fearful of the way some people dress.Or congregate.
Most parents don't want a house full of their kids friends. A small number of parents don't mind. So what we have is the social gatherings at a certain house discriminated against because of the way they dress and gather.
I know a lot of kids who have never been in trouble and they wear urban cloths.
And, let's not forget about "Individual Responsibility" all of us ethically can only be held accountable for our own actions. Nobody else!
You know to condemn a building when a tenant gets caught dealing drugs is wrong.
Innocent people who had nothing to do with the crime thrown on the street.
The owner and innocent tenants of the building made to share in the punishment of the crimninal. The criminal going free most of the time.
I know racism, the City taught me well.. If your a minority and poor they don't want us here.
Sometimes the tenant is not so innocent. A lot of these tenants are lonely women, and when they move into a the new neighborhood they meet a boyfriend, and that is where the problem comes in. It is usually the boyfriend and his friends that make the trouble. So the woman who originaly rented the apartment gets used and victimized by the boyfriend, then the city moves in and victimizes her again. Then the city proceeds to tell all the other landlords to punish her for the rest of her life by not renting to her. I've seen this time after time, it never changes. In a way, they are not only holding the landlord responsible, they are also damaging the tenant who lived there, and don't even get me going on the effect it has on the children, but the city's DFL doesn't seem to care about the children too much unless there is some money they can get for a pet program somewhere. They keep proving it over and over.
3:10 PM: you are so right! I've seen it time and again.
and who is responsible for the crime that occurs at these residence?
Society's child
Martin Owings wrote -
For the anonymous poster that told me to "go f*ck myself" I have a reply.
I can handle that. I think your anger is mis-directed, but I can handle it.
Let's engage and talk more about why you think my suggestion on open and honest dialog ragarding race/insititutional racism warrants I go "F*ck" myself?
You talked about how angry you are and how angry the community is and how fed up you are with talking.
Let's talk about the alternatives to honest and peaceful engagement.
Here is what I think will happen if we turn toward/follow your un-written alternative.
You will protest and riot and people, innocent people, will be hurt, property (in the very communities you live in) will be destroyed. The police, who are controlled by the very government whose policies you want to change, will be called in and that will perpetuate still more violence and you and others will be arrested and hospitalized or worse.
Then you'll you'll go home, after you've been released from jail or the hospital and have more reason to hate, but less power to do anything to change that thing you hate.
Eventually the hate will consume you until your left with nothing but an empty hollow existence which is even more manipulated by the very institutions you set out to change.
Unless you've got another plan which you have not yet revealed, I don't think your alternatives will work for the betterment of yourself or the community.
By the way, I'm not someone who comes out of the "woodwork" to talk nice when these issues come up.
I have a problem with the way the city and goverment have dealt with institutional racism, both in the past and in the present.
The difference between our two appraoches is that I think mine is one of "postive" unity which includes "all" the people in the community not just the pissed off people.
If you don't think it works, I'd like to direct you to MLK's work during the Civil Rights movement for evidence that it does.
So again, I'm calling for a Community Meeting or series of meetings to discuss the issues of RACE and Institutional Racism.
Out of that I would like to form a task force, committee or organization that could effectively bring actionable demands to those in places of power.
As an alternative to inaction on the part of those institutions I would like to leverage the legal system to remedy those greivances which they refuse to address.
In the bargain, I would like to see us, you and me and many others come together and learn something about eachother.
Break down the barriers and get at the real issues around race and racism.
I want justice, you want action, lets see what happens when the two come together.
Martin Owings
So, you'd like to sit down and talk? Just like we should sit down and talk to Iran or N. Korea? If we compare these two nations and those that run them, you will see ones who will not change their minds and will use tricks and ploys to cover their real agenda. I wouldn't trust anyone sent from the city of st. paul to talk about a peaceful resolution. I think picketing to call attention to corruption and dirty deeds by mayors, council members and the like is fine! rioting and picketing to stop a war that this country is fighting for our freedom (to be able to picket, I might add) is the thing that makes no sense to me. There is no such thing as "unity". The world has never and will never see unity. So it's left up to a few who have to use dissension to set a few things straight and on the narrow path. Everyone would rather go through the very broad and open gate, but that doesn't make it the right path! I know you think you are being diplomatic here, Martin, but it just doesn't fly and it never has.
Hi All,
I personally wish there were people like Martin on the City counsel. We probably wouldn't be in this mess right now..
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