(RETITLED) FRANKEN, "Unfit for office" Recount May Give Franken Senate Seat
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posted by Bob at Wednesday, November 05, 2008
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Wednesday, November 05, 2008
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24 Comments:
Coleman campaign declares victory; Franken says race 'too close to call'
By Rachel E. Stassen-Berger
rstassen-berger@pioneerpress.com
Article Last Updated: 11/05/2008 09:45:58 AM CST
Republican Sen. Norm Coleman's campaign is declaring victory this morning while Democratic challenger Al Franken says the tight Senate race is "too close to call."
At 8:30 a.m., the race between Coleman and Franken stood where it had for hours — Coleman had an ever so slight lead in voting. With 100 percent of precincts reporting, Coleman was leading Franken by 0.03% — or 726 votes — according to unofficial results from the Minnesota Secretary of State's office. That thin margin triggers an automatic recount under Minnesota law.
Secretary of State Mark Ritchie said a recount wouldn't begin until mid-November at the earliest and would probably stretch into December. It would involve local election officials from around the state.
"No matter how fast people would like it, the emphasis is on accuracy," Ritchie said.
Earlier today, the Associated Press called the race for Coleman but took it back mid-morning, saying it had called the race prematurely.
"The Senator is thrilled and humbled to be given the opportunity to serve the people of Minnesota for another six years," said Coleman campaign manager Cullen Sheehan in a statement. "Today is a time for us to come together as a state and a nation. There is much work to be done, and the Senator is ready to roll up his sleeves and bring people together to get it done."
Coleman plans to speak to reporters later today.
Franken spoke to reporters this morning and said the race was too close to call.
"Let me be clear. This race is too close to call and we do not yet know who won," Franken said. "It's going to be a little longer before we have a winner."
Franken's campaign is already working with former U.S. Attorney David Lillehaug on the recount procedures.
Lillehaug said every ballot would "have to be properly analyzed" and said the Franken campaign is interested in hearing about voting irregularities that may have happened Tuesday, which might impact the outcome of the race.
Minnesota law triggers an automatic recount if the winner is up by less than 0.5 percent of the total number of votes cast for that office. The loser in the race can waive an automatic recount — but that is unlikely in this race.
A losing candidate in a race can also request a recount if the vote is not close enough to trigger an automatic recount. The loser would have to pay for the recount.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
My POST AND TITLE!
click above
With 100 percent of the 4,130 precincts reporting, Coleman had an unofficial margin of 601 votes out of nearly 2.9 million cast. Recounts are required in races with a winning margin of less than one half of 1 percent.
9:59, I will tell you who voted for FRANKENSTEIN. RABID Democrats who listened to that dry radio show of his where he dumped his hatred for anyone who didn't agree with him. I'd like to see his spineless ass come here to A Democracy for a SCHOOLING in patriotism.
With 100 percent of precincts reporting, Coleman was leading Franken by 0.03% — or 726 votes — according to unofficial results from the Minnesota Secretary of State's office.
"FRANKEN, "Unfit for office and to SICK to concede". COLEMAN WINS SENATE"
NORM COLEMAN 1,211,625
AL FRANKEN 1,210,900
So, One million two hundred thousand voters are just 'rabid' democrats?
Stay Classy Bob, nobody does it like you.-not. You hurl an insult at over a million Minnesotans because you disagree with us. Whatever.
Eric
Franken is a celebrity, but the feeling in my gut is that I just didn't want this guy representing me in the Senate.
11:52, I can respect that, apparently over a million people didn't want him there.
I'm just a little perplexed at the name calling of the voters when its so close. What the hell?
Eric
I agree with Eric
4:47,,,, who agrees with Eric? The invisible man.
Franken is a man who claims he HATES us M_ther F...in conservatives.
Do any of you goofballs who voted for him think he would have been bi-partisan? You're all Nut's!
Jimmy Carter was the worse President in history and yet a majority of Democrats put him into office. Good thing they didn't get to make a mistake on Frankenstein.
I drive an 18 wheeler delivering steel all across MN and WI, and listen to a lot on MPR. they've been quite good at replaying all the debates and a lot of speeches from all three senate candidates, and it may suprise those of you that make your decisions based on the ads on TV (Bob, did you actually hear that comment when he was on Air America?), but Franken is quite wonkish when talking about the issues. unfortunately for Al, he wasn't able to get that part of his personality/intellect across to enough people.
and before you all decry his "too sick to concede" "mentality", the latest SoS update has the total at a 477 vote lead, down from the 700 or so this morning. they're gonna recount the ballots, it's a state law. let them do the legal thing...
and Bob, I'm pretty sure most historians will be ranking Bush 2 quite a bit further up the "worst president ever" list than Carter...
Bush has a approval rating higher then the house and senate.So does that mean this is the worst congress in history?
Bush will be viewed differently in 20 years then he is now.Once the Middle East calms down and democracy spreds his ratings will go up.Our enemies know Americans well, kill us and we will retreat.Americans for the most part are gutless and can't weather casualties.Period!Bush will also be viewed as getting a head start on this rescue bill going beyond Republican views and leading America.He also kept focused and didn't waver due to media and party pressure.He saw the big picture and understood that being a leader is much more important to America then polls and aproval ratings.
So lets let history judge and give Obama a chance to bat and see how he leads.
Jim
Frankenstien scares me too Bob.
Jim @ 9:04 says: "Bush has a approval rating higher then the house and senate.So does that mean this is the worst congress in history?" Jim, always remember there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. (and polling...) While I couldn't immediately find the 2008 congressional incumbency re-election statistics, take a look at this chart: http://www.fairvote.org/?page=1480
for those that don't want to click through, the chart says that only once in the last 50 years have the incumbent congress won LESS than 90% re-election (and that was barely below 90%). I doubt this election will be much different. so basically, people think congress sucks, but their own congressperson is far above the general suckitude and coasts to reelection... I'd be happy to listen to an alternative theory on how we can have a 9% approval rating yet a 90% re-election rate...
I will also agree that we're too close to view Bush's long term historical outlook. My only caveat to your statement is that people have been killing each other in the middle east for thousands of years and it is pretty self-important of us to think we can "fix" the middle east problem in a generation...
I will however disagree with your statement "Our enemies know Americans well, kill us and we will retreat.Americans for the most part are gutless and can't weather casualties". We took massive causalties in both world wars, and we hardly retreated. We only seem to have problems when we go to war for less than wholly sound reasoning. (see Vietnam and Iraq).
7:59 says: "So, I guess all Americans are a bunch of dumb ass uninformed morons who listen to nightly news sound bites then vote."
I'm even more cynical than you are, I have my doubts people even watch the nightly news before they voted...
Eric I agree with you on the world wars but also believe we don't fight like that anymore.America is a country that wants it right now.Fast.Computers,cell phones and so on and when we go to war we want it now.
When we fought the world wars we knew it was for our existance at that point.When we have fought our wars after world wars it wasn't for our existance at that moment.We as people can't see what we do now and how it will affect us in 10-20 years.Look at energy and Americans savings account.We don't see the future.
Jim
Jim, I think you're answering me from another thread.
What you said I agree with. As a matter of fact I have said that 'now' attitude really hurts the poor worst.
I call it the resistance to the delay of gratification.
Its exactly what led to the financial crisis on Wall Street, part of the foreclosure problem, and why we couldn't be patient and finish off Bin Laden and the job in Afghanistan. Its why stimulus checks seem a better deal than low interest loans. Its why the government is willing to increase the deficit while pretending to givaway tax cuts. It why you see a 40,000 dollar car parked in front of a 30,000 house. Its why these kids buy this bs gold and put it on their ears, teeth, and around their necks, and none of them live on their own or can afford to. Its why college enrollment is waaaay higher than college graduation.
One thing Obama has said over and over is that its not going to be easy to make things right. He said we all are going to have to sacrifice and the days of easy money are gone.
Somehow, people have ignored that part.
Eric
Baracks fine but Franken is one crazy white guy.
John
Just wait till your beloved Obamma Nationalizes everyones 401k plan and see how they like him.
Senate foes dig in and await recount
Coleman lead shrinks as local officials review results
By Rachel E. Stassen-Berger and Jason Hoppin
Pioneer Press
Article Launched: 11/07/2008 12:01:00 AM CST
By Monday, the results of Minnesota's U.S. Senate race should be verified.
Until then, the number of votes separating Republican Sen. Norm Coleman and Democratic challenger Al Franken will keep changing, bit by bit by bit.
Throughout Thursday — two days after the election — Coleman held the lead. But his advantage grew to a high of 590 votes and shrank to a low of 236.
None of the leads was even close to ending the presumed need for a recount — scheduled to begin Nov. 18. Under Minnesota law, a recount is automatic if results show the winner and loser less than one half of 1 percentage point apart. As it stood Thursday, Coleman and Franken were separated by just tenths of a point.
Such slight shifts are not unusual in any race after local election officials verify their results and make small changes to the totals. But little in this year's Senate race — the state's most expensive and one of the most bitter — has been usual, so the tiny switches are drawing attention.
At the Coleman campaign's request, Republican volunteers are watching the counties' secured ballot boxes to guard against tampering. Perhaps as soon as today, the Minnesota Secretary of State will host a recount summit meeting with representatives from both campaigns, his office and the state attorney general's office to discuss procedures. And both campaigns have started assembling teams to make sure the recount is conducted fairly.
Coleman's team received a bit of a blow Thursday when former U.S. Attorney Tom Heffelfinger said he would not guide the Republican recount effort.
In September, the city of St. Paul hired Heffelfinger, a Republican, to lead a review of law-enforcement tactics during September's Republican National Convention. The review is scheduled to be complete by Dec. 15.
Late Wednesday, after learning of Heffelfinger's role in the recount, St. Paul Mayor Chris Coleman asked him to choose one assignment or the other.
"I made a mistake, thinking I could take on both responsibilities," Heffelfinger said Thursday.
Although Chris Coleman is a Democrat and a Franken supporter, the politics of the Senate race reportedly didn't enter into the discussion.
"(Chris Coleman) didn't raise anything that I wasn't focused on, which was, 'How can I do both at the same time?' " Heffelfinger said.
By the end of business Thursday, the Coleman campaign hadn't named a replacement.
Coleman spokesman Mark Drake said the campaign already has volunteers in some counties and is seeking volunteers in all 87 counties to work with county election officials to "preserve the contents of the ballot boxes."
Most of the volunteer work involves sitting in the county offices.
Drake said he did not know how long those volunteers would keep up the vigil. "For now," he said, "we want them there."
Another former Minnesota U.S. attorney, David Lillehaug, is helping the Franken campaign's recount effort. Alan Weinblatt, a lawyer who frequently represents the Minnesota DFL Party, is on the team, too.
The Franken campaign also sent a fundraising plea Thursday to supporters to help it monitor the recount.
"We need every resource we can muster to ensure that Minnesotans' voices are heard — and to make sure that every vote is properly counted," campaign manager Stephanie Schriock said in the pitch. She said the campaign planned to have staffers in every county during the recount.
Because the margin is so close, the state pays for the recount; but the campaigns pay for their own monitoring of the effort.
So far, neither team has filed any legal challenges to Tuesday's vote, nor have they said national recount experts will be on hand to watch over the effort. Those steps may yet come.
The recount itself won't start until after Nov. 18. That's when a statewide canvassing board — made up of Secretary of State Mark Ritchie, two state Supreme Court judges and two district judges — will meet.
The board is expected to pronounce the need for a recount in the Senate race and three others — two state House races and a state Senate race — and certify the results of the election. After the meeting, the recount can begin.
Ritchie said some Minnesotans have called his office to complain the start of the recount is so far away. Some calls have been obscene, he said.
Until Nov. 18, there is a lot going on with the 2.9 million ballots cast in the Senate race.
Until next week, local election officials will be verifying the results of Tuesday's election.
In that process, the difference between Coleman and Franken's votes has shifted. When results were first tallied Wednesday morning, Coleman's lead was 725 votes; by Thursday evening, his lead was 236 votes.
Ramsey County Elections Manager Joe Mansky said his office has almost completed verification of its vote totals. The last of the suburban Ramsey County ballots arrived at his office Thursday from Maplewood.
Verification must be completed by Monday, when local results are presented to county canvassing boards, typically made up of county comissioners, for certification.
Those results are forwarded to the state canvassing board for final certification.
In the meantime, the actual ballots are kept in banker's boxes and sealed with stickers placed by an election judge. The seals won't be broken until the recount starts, or by court order, should it come to that.
Mansky also said counting machines are cleaned and tested to make sure they are working properly but that two of every thousand ballots are miscounted.
In the Senate race, that machine miscount would equal a flawed result in about 5,800 ballots.
That's why it's crucial to have the paper ballot available for a recount, he said.
"We know that no computer is perfect. The search for a perfect computer is a fool's errand. And that's why we don't rely on them," Mansky said.
Meanwhile, an audit of the election results already is under way in 202 randomly selected precincts. That audit, planned well before anyone knew the outcome of the Senate race, must be completed a week from today.
MIT professor Charles Stewart III, who studies election machines and voting processes, said machines used in most of Minnesota have a very small rate of error — smaller, he said, than hand counts typically have. But he said the machines could produce errors from vibrations or debris on the scanner.
He praised Minnesota's elections system, particularly its transparency.
"That's why everybody's excited about this recount," Stewart said.
Hi All,
I was wrong. It appears Franken had legitimate concerns to have the recount. Franken is down by less than 200 votes.
I hope like hell this sick angry man doesn't get in the senate.
5:34 said,(Bob, did you actually hear that comment when he was on Air America?),
my response; Like many of you I seen the "I hate those Mother F..ers" tape in a political commercial. Franken appeared to be taping his show, he was wearing a headset, he may or may not of been aware he was being filmed. I could not despise this man as I do if I hadn't been a regular of his program. I use to keep myself informed on what the KOOKS of the far left were up to.
In looking at the recount and the potential of Franken winning this I would encourage people to look at the results of the Wilson - Garza City Council race in Saint Paul's Ward 1 in 1989. All of the ballots were basically the same optical scan that most of the metro uses.
In that race the results on election night had Garza ahead by 49 votes - 3562 Garza - 3513 Wilson
After the recount was completed the results were 3645 Wilson 3644 Garza (and eleven for the "canvassing board")
After the "canvassing board" ruled the final vote was 3649 Wilson and 3647 Garza. 4 votes in the trash.
My point is that in this race the voting machines had awarded 7075 votes from the 7,300 voters that cast votes and the 7,296 that were countable once reviewed by human eyes. So, it was about one in twenty-five voters in ward one that screwed up their ballot.
Now, that may be high because we are talking about an inner-city district, but we are also talking about a district that votes about 80% DFL, and still did 70% for Franken in this race. In fact HD 65A which is basically Ward 1 in Saint Paul cast 8,843 votes for Franken. If one in twenty-five people in this district filled out their ballot wrong again (the same way they have filled it out since 1989 because nobody stops them) then Franken would pick up 354 of the 438 votes he needs just in this one house district.
The election isn't over.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Fat Lady is not singing either
Listen to Ron Paul telling you what is coming on November15th.
Get ready to lose your dollars. The meetings for a new monetary system start Nov. 15th. This is a done deal that Obama is lock step with. He had to be, otherwise they would not have let him win.
part 1/2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqN2EKuXX2g
part 2/2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uo29Oa-e61I
Dr. Paul will be on CNN's American Morning tomorrow morning (11/06/08) at 7:54 am eastern.
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/
http://www.dailypaul.com/
Ron Paul is a fruitcake with nuts.
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