MINNESOTA HAS ONE OR MORE CITIES OFFERING ILLEGAL SANCTUARY
posted by Bob at Tuesday, March 03, 2009
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Tuesday, March 03, 2009
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56 Comments:
Jeff requested this story.
The mayors and police chiefs of Minneapolis and St.Paul have come out staunchly against a plan announced by Governor Pawlenty to roll back sanctuary laws that restrict immigration enforcement by local police.
St.Paul passed such an ordinance in 2004.
St.Paul mayor Coleman said :
" I don't think the Governor has the authority to tell me how to run the police department, and this is bad public safety ".
The police chiefs from both cities say this, that routine immigration status would interefere with efforts to establish trust amongst the illegals in a trade off for other information about other crimes these immigrants commit.
Jeff Says :
Its part of the polices job to do it.
If they are taking the time to gain the trust of those very immigrants, why not check their immigration status and at least note it ?
Well Chuck, your crying about dollars Pawlenty wont give to poor poor cities like St.Paul which wants to tax and fee the crap out of us and your friendly Mayors and Police Chiefs support crimminals that are bleeding our resources to the bone ?
Try to justify this !
Look what Obama is giving Foreign Aid 50 Billion Where is he getting all this money?
http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/obama_foreign_aid/2009/03/02/187543.html?s=al&promo_code=7B56-1
10:09 - This is pretty simple, the Federal Government doesn't give the City of Saint Paul any money to be INS agents. It isn't the City of Saint Paul's job to be border patrol agents.
So, if someone commits a crime in the City of Saint Paul then we will check to see if they are legal but if someone is calling in to report a crime or are victims of a crime we don't check on their immigration status.
...and we don't pull over someone on suspicion of being a Mexican in Saint Paul.
I grew up on the West Side and have Chicano friends who's families have lived in Saint Paul for more than a hundred years.
If you think that I would be OK with Pawlenty's insulting efforts to have their citizenship checked every day when they walk down the street you can kiss.. ...
Pawlenty just continues to show how racist he is. This is nothing to do with national security and is an insult to every Chicano in the country.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Jeff Says :
Its part of the polices job to do it.
Jeff, don't fall into the Nancy Lazaryan zone of quoting law that doesn't exist.
A Sanctuary City places no restriction on any police or legal officials and impedes no legal or investigative process simply by virtue of declaring itself a sanctuary.
Sanctuary City simply means that the police and administration have stated publicly that they are not going to do the work of immigration officials, especially when that system is in crisis and not functional.
Local cops are not trained to handle immigrations cases beyond asking are they citizens or documented workers- if they speak the language.
They'd rather be able to solve a crime or arrest a drug dealer, domestic abuser, thief or gang-bangers which takes information from witness or people in the vicinity.
Cities like these are a good thing where immigrants aren't afraid of their whole family being sent to detention for deportation when they report a crime, show up to identify a perp, or get beaten in front of their children by a spouse.
I use those examples because that exactly what was told to me by cops who work here on the East side.
We spend a shitload of taxes supporting the Homeland Security Department who's in charge of controlling illegal immigration. Its been worse under the Republicans. Just like FEMA (also a part of Homeland Security) that it was when it was under Justice and Treasury.
Bottom line, the demand needs to be on the Feds. Local know they have enough to do serving and protection their municipality. That's why cops are OK with Sanctuary.
At the Federal level, the court has not ruled that this federal law is something local governments have to enforce.
In saying all of that, I can see in the near future (year or two), a big change to this. Cities and States have their own Constitutions and Article X of the Constitution express the right of states to make their own laws that do not run against the US Constitution. Many Charter Cities also retain a similar right. Its the self governing principle.
How invasive in the governing of our states and local governments should the Federal government be. As you know, at the federal level, new laws set a precedence.
The same principle that's applied to forcing cities to comply with this, can be used to decide who can be married, what kind of housing can be built, who can build freeways and tollways, etc.
Eric
Send all those damn illegals home. There ain't enough jobs here now for hometown people.
froggy
Chuck, you were the one barking about LGA money from the state that St.Paul wasn't getting.
Well, part of the reason the state doesn't have the cash is because of this issue.
How can Coleman case on Pawlenty for cutting state subsidys (LGA), when Coleman is supporting the very policys( harbouring illegals in St.Paul ) that are preventing Pawlenty from giving money we cannot afford to give and don't have because of this very problem ?
Don't you agree that health and human Services is a big chunk of the budget that is consuming the budget to no ends ?
180 Million a year for illegals.
They might just as well walk down to the department of revenue or wherever Minnesota banks with our tax dollars, and hold em up with a gun.
I can concede somewhat that it is not local police that are primarily responcible for Immigration enforcement, but the police chiefs and moyors of these cities should not come right out and condone illegal immigration like they do and turn a blind eye.
We just make it easy for these illegals to keep ringing up the tab when the Mayor comes out and says these things publicly so that the illegals can hear what he says and there you go, there here in droves. NO DETERRENT !
I could make this a campain issue and this would cause serious damage to Coleman.
Sure, you won't get any latino votes for doing so, but this is typical campain strategy around election time.
Plenty of latinos in St.Paul.
Go get em Coleman.
Jeff Matiatos
The latinos don't need a gun, they just have to say " I am an illegal so give it to me "
When the mayor has to cut police and fire because they can't make payroll, then these cops and fireman can join the ranks of the illegals on welfare.
Then ask the cops and fireman what they think of the mayors hypocritacl stance on budget consuming illegals that are partly responcible for why these cops and fireman are being layed off in the first place.
I would love for Rush Limbaugh to run against Coleman for Mayor.
He would tear him up.
Jeff Matiatos
Ask the mayor to take a cut in pay and he might start to think a little different about why it is that he has to take a cut in pay.
How about it Coleman ?
Take a voluntary cut in pay as a show of solidarity with the police and fireman you want to lay off.
One corporate executive announced before congress that he was forfitting his entire salary.
Your turn people.
Jeff Matiatos
Jeff,
That CEO made 300 million in bonuses the previous two years. Most CEO's keep their salary very low (80,000 to 200,000) to keep their income taxes low- and take most of their compensation in the form of company shares and automatic bonuses.
Its one way they game the system that regular joes cannot.
-----
There are three issues I keep hearing about illegals:
1.crime,
2.social service drain and 3.citizenship.
Those are three separate issues.
Crime will not be stopped. Any illegal who commits a crime can be turned over to the Feds. Nothing in the Sanctuary City memo denies this.
Social Service drain. Really? I'm not going to do the research now, but I doubt that they cost us 1% of our social service budget. Most go without these services.
Th real culprit are those who provide jobs. They pay illegals less, and turn a blind eye to their status because its cheaper than paying an American and they know they can pretty much treat them like whatever. Even Mitt Romney had illegals cleaning his house and taking care of his lawn.
You want to take a bite out of undocumented workers? Start penalizing businesses that continue to violate employment law by hiring them. You won't have to go far, just look at your favorite restaurant's kitchen, any hotel service, and then expect your costs to rise. I'm all for it.
And the last issue that bother people is that they are not legally immigrating. That's the point I hit on that the cities don't have an obligation to the federal governments job. Same thing with social services. They are throwing people off a welfare and out of houses and they can't figure out who's a citizen?
You're picking a fight with wrong level of government and giving a free pass to the feds and businesses that hire undocumented workers.
And, Bob, your title Minnesota Has One Or More Cities Offering Illegal Sanctuary - it sort of indicates that its illegal to have sanctuary cities. You are wrong. It may be very disagreeable, but its the right of those local governments to govern themselves.
Eric
Eric said;
And, Bob, your title Minnesota Has One Or More Cities Offering Illegal Sanctuary - it sort of indicates that its illegal to have sanctuary cities. You are wrong. It may be very disagreeable, but its the right of those local governments to govern themselves.
My response;
I didn't title this post. Check out the link again. You will see "MINNESOTA HAS ONE OR MORE CITIES OFFERING ILLEGAL SANCTUARY"
at the top of the page.
Don't you agree that health and human Services is a big chunk of the budget that is consuming the budget to no ends ?
The city has no health and human services budget. That would be the county and the state. So, its not analogous.
Then ask the cops and fireman what they think of the mayors hypocritacl stance on budget consuming illegals that are partly responcible for why these cops and fireman are being layed off in the first place.
As I explained above, its not city money and to enforce the federal stance would cost us more resources. I like the way things are, cops pull them over or pick them up for something and run them. If they are tagged, call the feds to come their problem out of our town.
I would love for Rush Limbaugh to run against Coleman for Mayor.
He would tear him up.
The only thing Rush would tear through is a bag Doritos with green hot sauce over them. Or, a bottle free Oxycotin.
Rush is complete gas bag who has never put himself out there for public service, or even allows opposing views on show unless he can humiliate them.
The beefy doofus couldn't even get the Constitution and Declaration straight. Basic Fifth Grade stuff for the non-drug addicts.
Get another hero Jeff, this one is a flawed phony.
Eric
Sure, the city doesn't per se have it's own Health and Human Services
agency (HHS). The city harbors the illegals that use it.
But, when the State HHS Department
is bleeding the State budget dry, it leaves little or no money for LGA and other aid to cash strapped cities.
HHS budget consumes a signifigant piece of the pie.
State tax revenues pay for just about everything.
I will say this though, the feds know they let this immigration thing get out of hand.
It is out of control and they have found that its better to keep them here as pawns every time one political party candidate or the other is running for re-election.
How big is the latino vote in California and the Southwest ?
Thats why the democrats want them up here so they to can cash in on the latino vote at your expence.
If I can say anything more, is that I believe this country stole the land from Mexico that now makes up a good chunk of the Southwest, therefore, I sometimes feel we should just let them come here no questionsed asked.
How about that pay cut Coleman ?
Jeff Matiatos
Wake up Chuck. Why should we wait for crimes to happen. Their being here IS a crime.
Did any of you click the link to this story, watch the 1 minute video, and read the rest ?
What about that don't you understand ?
Your all in denial !!!
Jeff Matiatos
What do you know about oxycotin Eric?
Jeff I will type this slowly so that maybe you can get it.
The City doesn't run the welfare office.
The state funds it through the counties. So, if the issue is illegals getting money from the state through the welfare office then maybe the state should tell the welfare office to check their citizenship.
Sounds like it old blame someone else Timmy that isn't doing his job.
So, where else is poor little Timmy and the hapless republicans that can't govern misplaced this money?
Because none, zilch, zero is the responsibility of City government who you are blaming it on.
It's not the schools because if the kids were born here they may very well be citizens and eligible for their public education.
So... how again is Pawlenty's mismanagement the City's fault?
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Well it seems St.Paul went so
far as to pass some kind of legislation through the council in 2004 providing for sanctuary.
Why don't we call it something other than sanctuary,unless your protecting somebody who has done something wrong ?
Having any kind of sanctuary legislation that exceeds Federal Laws against illegal immigration is wrong.
Having sanctuary laws on the books in trade for votes is wrong.
Having sanctuary laws on the books that tell illegals it's ok if your here consuming hundreds of millions of dollars.
Now you tell me why Chris Coleman or any mayor should bitch about not getting money from the State, County, ie. TAX PAYORS when it's being consumed this way ?
But, this post is supposed to be about restricting enforcement by local police of illegals.
I think the Governor has every right to tell any city that if these sanctuary cities will not respect Federal immigration laws, if needed, he can call out the National Guard ( I know I sound like Nancy here ) and lock this city down.
In the interest of our State economy, that with the current crisis that threatens everyone, the Governor must do everything in his power to protect the safety and ECONOMIC security of the State if the FEDS wont enforce their own laws.
Remember Executive order 9066 of 1942 ?
Well, we need an executive order from the Governor that requires deportation of all illegals due to a security threat to our State financial economy.
Think about that Chuck.
I think the Minnesota Constitution gives him the power.
I haven't found it, but I'am looking to see if it's possible.
I'll get back to ya.
Jeff Matiatos
Good posting Jeff.
St.Paul has been harboring criminal from the 1930's, at that time they were called "Gangsters"!
I really don't care what party someone belongs to, from 1996 till now I have seen that the DFL and the Unions control St.Paul.
People out there are calling these politician Nazi, when they are not Germans.
They act like Hitler and they even sound like Hitler, they are the Democrats covering up for anybody that say they are DFL. Politicians and they are in sheep's clothing.
We watch how St.Paul's City Councilman Dave Thune was a protester at the RNC and how women and a 14 yo. boy was treated by spaying Pepper spay to they eye, but no one hassled Thune, or was these DFL Union Police standing by him to protect him from any harm?
We have Thune sending people e-mail in this town calling them names like we see happen here at the blog when they don't agree with what we say.
I don't ever claim to be a angel, after hearing what come from the mouths of out two Star people that post and try to "change" the way we think.
Let look at how much money St.Paul would have went ahead and let the BRIGES Construction go ahead.
We would have been putting money into something to help someone get rich, when in 1965 when St.Paul made the people that lived on the flats were told that they have to sell to the city or their homes would be condemned and they would just take the land.
The Lafayette Bridge was planed in the early 1940's, the city making money off other and their home.
They told the people at that time that NO One would ever live in that flood pain again.
Then these so called City Council people must be getting something out of this under the table.
Don Luna got on the board of WACO, he was the St.Paul Clerk under Randy Kelly, then he had something to do with the police and St.Paul Parks.
That was a conflict and DON LUNA tried his best to get the BRIDGES thing going.
Is there a song called "Slip The money Under The Table"?
If Not, there will be for the NEW St.Paul Theme Song.
Do You Think That OBAMA and FRANKEN won the election by all these illegal's voting?
Your Friend or Foe?
Bill Dahn
www.billdahn.com
www.billdahn.blogspot.com
It would be vain for anybody to believe there isn't corruption in politics and within our judiciary.
Nazis are bad people, but to compare some of our local corrupt politicians and judges to Nazis is giving them more credit than they deserve.
Actually, their worse and we haven't quite discovered a name for them yet.
I know it may sound like my ideas of deportaion are extreme.
I am not a racists like some think I might be.
But look, Our Governments answer to illegal immigration is to build a wall costing billlions of dollars.
The answer might be to place sanctions on the Mexican Government.
Mexico is one of the biggest benificiarys of U.S. Government aid.
Cut it off.
Whats the point in giving it to that country if the people over there aren't satisfied and continue to come here illegally ?
So the corrupt Mexican Government takes our foreign aid and supports the drugs coming into this country.
Does that sound familiar Chuck ?
I admire your compassion for people Chuck, but you have an indentation in your brain that intereferes with your ability to view the world the way it really is.
Same with you liberal democrats like Amy kloubaschar, however the hell you spell it.
Your a good guy Bill.
Jeff Matiatos
Bill,
1. Police Unions are more Republican. Between Mpls and St Paul they supported Bush, McCain, Norm Coleman and Pawlenty (split).
I know you're on a roll and don't like facts to mess up your story.
2. Barack Obama won with record support from whites, black and asians too. Rural whites are what put him over the top.
Again, the facts are there.
3. The DFL was against the project. Silent Republican Randy Kelly push it on the DFL controlled Council and they rejected it. You're right about the investors and others running the Hispanics and others off of that land then one generation later its suddenly prime property. It was the DFL that recognized this and sought input from the relatives of the families that have live there since the turn of the last century.
4. Since the mid-90's, union membership in St Paul has gone down. How do you come to the conclusion that have been in control?
-----------------
Jeff,
The funding for social service programs is many times handed down from the feds with strings attached by a half and half tab. If some of that isn't used, it goes back for one of the leeching Red states to use. Those funds can't be used for anything but what they were allotted for.
Before I went quoting Mary Kiffmeyers hateful Minn Majority numbers, I'd find out how they measure that. Don't let your own prejudices run ahead of logic and fact. Do the research.
Also speaking of Nancy, here's a two words that you should look up. Charter City. The governor cannot force the city to do anything like that. Also, there is a pay and hiring freeze at the mayors office.
Gotta run and watch the Family Guy.
Eric
Ok, so you say the Governor doesn't have the authority ?
Article V Section 3 says :
" He is comander in Chief of the military and naval forces and may call them out to execute the laws, suppress insurrection and repel invasion " .
Would any of you disagree that illegal mexicans crossing over the boarder by the millions doesn't constitute an invasion ?
This country has never given political assuylm to these folks so what legal grounds does an illegal have ?
Coleman can't f with the Governor here.
Pawlenty can call out the National Guard and lock down this city and repel the invasion of illegals Colemen admits he is protecting.
Wow.
Jeff Matiatos
Nancy, can you put a petition together for the Governor to sign to repel the invasion ?
Frady cat
And to think our capital city would harbor illegals.
This is grounds for impeachment of the mayor and city council !!
Do I hear recall ?
No, thats re-con. Where is Sgt.Slaughter. Remember him Chuck.
Get in formation Chuck, the troops want to hear from you.
Would any of you disagree that illegal mexicans crossing over the boarder by the millions doesn't constitute an invasion ?
Oh boy.
Jeff, 'invasion' in a military since or national security sense means just that. Illegal immigration, is called that- because that's what it is. They are not coming here as foreign nationals to take over the United States for a their home country (Pawlenty wouldn't get to decide that without permission from the President or every Southwestern state would have done this by now). They come here to assimilate and work, and go to schools and be Americans.
Its not an invasion. All of the Redneck states would have beat you to this as they have been trying to beat the drum for a decade now and have lost every single federal case they have brought forth.
Go after businesses that hire illegals and you'll kill the source.
Try thinking.
Eric
...and the laws the governor would execute would have to be the state laws. Using the Guards to enforce a federal statute runs him into the same problem, he's got no jurisdiction.
Everytime I think you deserve some credit for thinking, you go on prove why you are in the situation you are and think the way you do.
No other word: idiot. Maybe dipstick.
Eric
I guess you don't understand our Minnesota Constitution that well do you ?
You don't know a hell of alot about crimminal statutes either.
Was it not a Federal crime for Oswald to blow Kennedys brains out ? If you want to believe Oswald did it.
If I recall, the State and local police had a duty to apprehend the person that did it. I guess States do have authority ( Jurisdiction to arrest for federal crimes ).
You do know a hell of alot about being a democrat though.
The Feds gave the states the right to create their constitutions and enforce them.
Now you may not call it an invasion because your imagining these mexicans must must have to come here illegally with tanks and RPGS in order to justify the Governors excercise of authority to repel an invasion.
The constitution never defines what an invasion is.
But you, being the Constitutional Scholar that you are, have defined it for us. Thank you Supreme Court Justice Eric.
We have the minutemen at the southern boarder helping REPEL the invaders.
There happens to be laws against trespassing and I would say that these illegals are tresspassing at the very least.
How about vagrancy ?
How about stealing other peoples identitys ?
How about prosecuting the welfare workers who knowingly give welfare to illegals ?
Do you understand the term illegal activity ?
You might start to think differently if one of these illegals rapes your daughter, steals your identity, murders someone you know, steals your car,
breaks into your home.
Your just a big pussy to afraid of your own party not letting you join in the fun of getting someone re-elected, than to acknowledge that we have a crisis on our hands.
These illegals using their children as shields to gain the sympathy of pussys like you to afraid to do anything about it.
Jeff Matiatos
We used the National Guard to help protect the political candidates for the RNC.
So if someone committed a crime against a candidate running for president, that would be a Federal crime and the Guardsmen on duty would have a duty to arrest that person.
The state and local police also had the authority to enforce Federal laws against commiting harm or disturbance to political candidates.
You don't know jack Eric.
Jeff Matiatos
Eric
10:37 PM
Eric, and Union are run by the DFL'ers and you can't alway make someone vote the way you want them to.
DFL wanted to know how you vote, why so they can have you fired.
People in unions can and will vote their mind , as long as no one interfare.
Police have to do as they are told, even if they are Repulicans.
Please, please, please send in the National Guard show what complete racist nut cases you are.
Jeff, all of this is designed to distract you from the real problems in this country, the ever widening gap between the wealthy and the vanishing middle class.
The fat cats want you to kick the dog and feel better.
The problem isn't the wealthy robber barons that are running off with all of the money and have driven this country to the brink, the problem is the poor Mexican who is trying to escape object poverty and get a job in the US picking beets in Moorhead.
What is always so wonderful about this racist rampage is that the Mexican immigrant is accused off stealing all of the jobs and the welfare money at the same time. The right wing first wants you to be afraid that they might cost you your job, but then gets second thoughts that it implies they are hard working and industrious and so has to accuse the immigrant of coming here to be on the doal... you can't have it both ways.
Anyway, its a joke its a distraction and it is an assault on every Chicano whose family has been in this country for a hundred years.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
I am going to lighten up on Eric here and give him a very interesting case to consider.
At first he will say " See I told you Jeff "
But then I will say that this court decision does not aply to illegals.
See Graham v. Richardson 403 U.S. 365 91 S.Ct. 1848 29 L.Ed.2d 534(1971).
What I got out of it was this, the Supreme Court held that a state statute that denies welfare benefits to "resident aliens" violates the Equal protection Clause.
In other words, legal residents.
So the state can I believe, create a statute that denies benefits to non legal aliens.
I still have to research and see whether Minnesota has a law against
granting benefits to illegals.
Jeff Matiatos
Illegals recieve benefits, tax refunds, et, al because democrats don't care about the rule of law.
They only care about building a "monstrosity" of "entitlement" in which all those "on the dole" know who to vote for.
It's all about power and who controls it.
Jeff Matiatos
Jeff - illegals can't vote... and the poor barely vote... and the right wing needs to brain wash you that it is those people who have no power that are making your life hard rather than the people who have the power and you have bought it hook line and sinker.
Read history.
This is how the upper crust always maintains control and power. They want you to believe that you are one lottery ticket away from being a millionaire and that you need to be concerned about "those evil poor people that are a drain on our society..." You see you are one of the good people that belong here. You are just like the millionaire fat cat and if it wasn't for those (fill in the blank... Mexican/Blacks/Jews/Irish) then you would be a millionaire too!
I have heard this before.
In the south.
In Germany.
In England.
Anywhere when the wealthy want to keep the focus away from them and their control and power.
As Dylan said in 1963... Only a pawn in their game...
A bullet from the back of a bush took Medgar Evers' blood.
A finger fired the trigger to his name.
A handle hid out in the dark
A hand set the spark
Two eyes took the aim
Behind a man's brain
But he can't be blamed
He's only a pawn in their game.
A South politician preaches to the poor white man,
"You got more than the blacks, don't complain.
You're better than them, you been born with white skin," they explain.
And the Negro's name
Is used it is plain
For the politician's gain
As he rises to fame
And the poor white remains
On the caboose of the train
But it ain't him to blame
He's only a pawn in their game.
The deputy sheriffs, the soldiers, the governors get paid,
And the marshals and cops get the same,
But the poor white man's used in the hands of them all like a tool.
He's taught in his school
From the start by the rule
That the laws are with him
To protect his white skin
To keep up his hate
So he never thinks straight
'Bout the shape that he's in
But it ain't him to blame
He's only a pawn in their game.
From the poverty shacks, he looks from the cracks to the tracks,
And the hoof beats pound in his brain.
And he's taught how to walk in a pack
Shoot in the back
With his fist in a clinch
To hang and to lynch
To hide 'neath the hood
To kill with no pain
Like a dog on a chain
He ain't got no name
But it ain't him to blame
He's only a pawn in their game.
Today, Medgar Evers was buried from the bullet he caught.
They lowered him down as a king.
But when the shadowy sun sets on the one
That fired the gun
He'll see by his grave
On the stone that remains
Carved next to his name
His epitaph plain:
Only a pawn in their game.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
So when and where Chuck do we draw the line with illegals.
Lets just stop enforcement at the border.
Help me understand the reasoning behind why we have enforcement at the border yet those that make it past the border are entitled to all the benifits of American citizens so long as they dont get caught commiting a crime ?
It seems the police would rather not pull over mexicans for fear that they wont have "A" drivers license and are illegals and clog up the courts.
It's just easier to let them go.
What happens to a legal citizen when they get pulled over ?
I am for immigration for everyone who waits their turn and does it right.
It just so happens that our neighbors from the south of the border are the biggest violaters of our immigration procedures.
Please, can you understand this ?
You say illegals can't vote ?
You may be right about that but consider that when the U.S. Government comes down hard on illegals, it persuades the majority legal latino population to vote for the party that tends to support the non legals.
Thats how it works and you FN know it.
Your not kidding me Chuck.
Jeff Matiatos
Jeff said...
"Help me understand the reasoning behind why we have enforcement at the border yet those that make it past the border are entitled to all the benifits of American citizens so long as they dont get caught commiting a crime ?"
Two things one...NOTHING STOPS THE INS FROM ARRESTING ANY ILLEGAL. Got it? So, an illegal has no protection once they make it over the border. Two... what the Supreme Court has said is that liberty and justice in this country is like the air we breath, once you are here you get it the same as everyone else. So, you can deport an illegal, but you can't starve them. You can deport an illegal, but you have to provide them with a lawyer. You can deport an illegal, but their kids can go to school.
With me Jeff? The Fed's can come and get them and send them back to Mexico, but bigoted, white, racist can't starve them, or hunt them down or make their legal relatives where gold six pointed stars on their coats so that all of the good people know that they are legal Mexicans.
And then Jeff said..
"It seems the police would rather not pull over mexicans for fear that they wont have "A" drivers license and are illegals and clog up the courts.
It's just easier to let them go."
Another Fairy tale compliments of Rush.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Chuck rememeber the fall of Rome.Government expanded to much and got to big.Bankrupting the people.Sound familiar.We have one problem in this country right now and his name is Barack Obama!
Ryan
Ryan, wow, what an interesting spin on the fall of the Roman Empire. I have never heard anyone suggest that as the reason for the fall of Rome. It has no basis in history, but its an interesting spin.
The usual blame for the fall of Rome was that once Constantine moved the Capitol to Constantinople the Western Empire became dominated by strong men who were never able to unify the country behind any one of them until in the early 5th century the germanic tribes were able to sack Rome several times (while leaving the Eastern Empire still standing).
It is my personal belief that it was the conversion of the Empire to Christianity under Constantine that did more to bring about the fall than any other factor.
Rome had survived for centuries by being multicultural and allowing all Gods to have a place in the Roman world. Traditionally when Rome would conquer a city the Roman general would make a sacrifice to the deity of the fallen town to show that the Roman Gods would welcome their God into the fold.
Converting to a very active Christian God made the Empire's sole at war with whoever wasn't a Christian and made everyone who had differing God's hostile to Rome.
You have to also remember that the belief system of 350 AD was that God was coming back anytime and so a good Christian would spend all of his time and energy in prayer and not engaged in the worries of the world. When you add to that a series of plagues that hit the city, you had a population convinced that the end was near and that devoting their life to prayer was a viable solution. The Roman Emperors in the 400's could hardly muster an army that could stop a girl scout troop let alone the Vandals.
By 500 AD there wasn't anyone left who knew how to fix the aqueducts and you couldn't maintain a city of that size.
Remember Rome survived for a thousand years as sin City and was totally wiped out within 150 years of becoming Christian
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Chuck,
That spin looks like a very nasty attack on Christianity. Rome was built on a foundation of Greek thought. Then the Christians converted some important Greek groups to Christianity. The main model for the US was Plato's Republic.
Get your facts straight before you attack decent things. It seems this city has lost its values and is ready to fall.
Excuse me 3:23 ???
Please read history.
Rome converted to Christianity with the conversion of the Emperor Constantine in 312 AD. and the council of Nicaea made it official in 325 AD.
Plato had been dead for at least six hundred years when that occurred. Greece had long since been conquered by Rome and no one on the planet would have any idea what you are talking about.
Remember not long before Constantine they were throwing the Christians to the lions. That only ended in 311 AD.
The Christians weren't very popular for their first 300 years. They were viewed as a very dangerous sect because they wouldn't agree to have their God be just one of the many Roman Gods. They and the Jews were monotheistic. Only one God.
With me.
Is it coming back to you now.
Like from one of the stories about Peter or Paul???
Wow, the things one has to explain here.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Sorry Charlie,
Corruption and arrogance killed Rome. This was too entrenched for the Christians to change overnight. The Roman were one of the most oppressive regimes in human history. They operated on slave power. St. Paul inspectors are much like the Roman soldiers (except they don't weare Fuller Brushes on their helmets)They are full of arrogance, pomposity and shit, and will bring about the fall of the Democrat empire. Future archaeologists will wonder about the dipshits who destroyed St. Paul.
5:24 - Read a book sometime.
Chuck Repke
Wow its funny to me, that this went from talk of issues with illegal’s to a fight over the fall of Rome...
Here are the real issue people, from a 25 year olds point of view, people have this view of illegal as people stealing all of our jobs, question is how many of them pay more than 20,000 a year? How many Minnesotans really want to work for 6.15 an hour cleaning toilets, making pizzas behind an oven in august or removing trash in the middle of January? Sorry these are not the jobs we worry about, we worry about the 40 to 50 thousand a year jobs that get cut in order to save money for companies that gave out loans for 250,000 dollar homes to kids my age working for 11 bucks an hour. Or that are job who dose all its financial transactions at a bank that bought those bad loans because at 11 bucks an hour with 2 kids it will only take 50 years to pay off that loan, no one thought maybe eating was better choice than paying back a loan that should never of been given out, but I’m now off the point.
We as Americans didn’t stop to think over the ten years, that the American dream is to live and prosper not to get back to zero. We spent too much, we trusted in the system to much, and we barrowed too much. So instead of blaming the profiteers, all the liars, and back room deals, or better yet are self, we blame the easiest target. Lets blame the little guys trying to make a better life for themselves and there families, lets go after those who shouldn’t be here (is there an Native American here who feels the same by the way? Do any of you know any also? They may feel the same to all of us good old white boys), they don’t know are ways and can’t speak as well as us lets blame them! Now lets check all those people we think may not be on the up and up. Its nothing more then persecution to make us feel like we are doing something. It’s also un-American, and sad.
But what do I know? I’m only 25. It saddens me to know end that my friends one the grandson of an illegal Mexican, are going out to fight wars started by men their fathers age to come home to be asked if he should be here. How dare anyone do this to a true American because he is Mexican in race? Nice way to come home to the land of the free, and home of the brave. Let’s take a clue from a great movie and start blaming Canada; we have to blame someone for this soon, before some thinks of blaming us.
Chuck,
You have an anti-religious agenda that is not justified.
Chuck and Eric just want these illegal's to have "sanctuary" here in St.Paul so they work cheap, and take the jobs of our home grown people. They needed their vote to get people like Obama & Franken in office.
We don't need illegal voting in America.
If you think its ok get out of town. Then there is ACORN cheating the election.
No body likes what you stand for Eric and Chuck.
Why?
What can of people are you really?
A can of Alpo.
1:43 - Excellent post!
You have hit the nail on the head concerning the lack of tolerance, and ignorance of those who so little understand the contribution that people of all heritages have made to this country. The irony of your example is spot on.
My point in going on and on about Rome was that when Rome was tolerant and multicultural it prospered. It embraced those who were different and welcomed them to be Roman. Rome fell when it quit being tolerant, became fearful and fear brings cowardice and decay.
If you fear those weeker than you, it says a great deal about you.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Chuck, I'm surprised you're taking them on in a serious manner about the Fall of Rome. These Ignoramuses can't accurately figure out how their own city works and what happened 15 months ago, let alone 1500 ears ago on the other side of the globe.
By the way, you are almost correct. You didn't take in account the rise of of the Frankish tribes becoming more civilized, the loyalty of the army to its field commanders over the people of Rome, and the Arab expansion.
---------
7:09 said:
Chuck and Eric just want these illegal's to have "sanctuary" here in St.Paul so they work cheap, and take the jobs of our home grown people.
Aside from not knowing how to write, is not knowing how to read your thing?
You are just like the rest.
Try reading the following, its in English, so you may have trouble. Here are some sentences I wrote in SEVERAL responses above.
Eric said:You're picking a fight with wrong level of government and giving a free pass to the feds and businesses that hire undocumented workers.
Eric said:You want to take a bite out of undocumented workers? Start penalizing businesses that continue to violate employment law by hiring them. You won't have to go far, just look at your favorite restaurant's kitchen, any hotel service, and then expect your costs to rise. I'm all for it.
Eric said:Go after businesses that hire illegals and you'll kill the source.
My position is pretty clear.
------------
No body likes what you stand for Eric and Chuck.
Why?
What can of people are you really?
7:14 AM
English must be your second or third language. Typical of those who bitch about immigrants.
As far as people not liking what I stand for:
We have a President with an approval rating of almost 70%.
We have Democrats in the Majority in Congress with an approval rating 20 points higher than Republicans.
We have a state legislature that has gone majority DFL.
We have a city where every council member is a DFLer.
None of these people were appointed, they were elected with a majority of voters. Therefore, I'd say a majority of the people like what I stand for and support.
You're the one on a blog set up to complain about how everyone is against you and nothing is going right for you.
Eric
Hmmm Eric when I see you at the convention we will have to debate a little Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire.
Veni, Vedi, Vici.
JMONTOMEPPOF
Chuck Repke
Hello Jeff
The city government is the biggest criminal "Aiding And Abetting"
I love your comments you post, you pick on all in government and some of these on this blog get pretty nervous and uneasy.
They get anxious to answer your post
"Aiding And Abetting" is a Crime, and St.Paul has the history of Aiding and Abetting criminals in the 1930's.
They told the "Gangsters" not to do any crimes here and this will stay a "Sanctuary" as long as they "didn't" pull any crimes here.
Then it all changed In the 1930's, when St. Paul was the hideout of choice for America's most famous gangsters
"MINNESOTA HAS ONE OR MORE CITIES OFFERING ILLEGAL SANCTUARY"
IT’S BEEN MORE THAN 70 YEARS
since a Who’s Who of the most notorious criminals in the land blighted St. Paul. At various times, John Dillinger, “Baby Face” Nelson, Alvin “Creepy” Karpis, and Ma Barker’s gang, along with Verne Miller, Fred Goetz, and “Machine Gun” Kelly, holed up here. These were bank robbers and hold-up men, kidnappers and murderers. Some were mean by nature; some had meanness thrust upon them by hard lives. All sought refuge from the law in St. Paul during the 1930s.
PS. St.Paul and their Police force are breaking the "law" by allowing
any crime, 'Big" or "small"!
Bill Dahn
www.BillDahn.com
Bill, in my opinion, Mayor kelly acted like one of these gangsters with his arbitrary enforcement of the city code like parking enforcement.
He had peoples cars stolen and impounded, scrapped to get these older cars out of the city.
Did you know their are about 20 exceptions under the statutes that let the city tow your car without your knowledge ?
Some of these gangster politicians are taking sanctuary in the very offices that they work in.
Take the judges in Ramsey County.
We have not had a terrorist threat or incident in this country by foriegn nationals since 9/11.
Look at all the extra security they have at the courthouse.
Do they really need it ?
I think these corrupt judges are afraid of the litigants they fuck over. Especially pro-se litigants exposing corruption.
Judges have been known to be targets for personal attack and let me tell you, well all I can say is that if someone else (not me) wanted to skew certain judges in Ramsey County, I wouldn't shed a tear .
But I guess they know that because it's the only other reason to justify all that security.
Jeff Matiatos
For the record, and for peace of mind, I have no intentions of or would myself or in cooperation with others, participate in any conduct that would be physically harmful to any judge anywhere.
My comments are simply expressed out of distrust and appaulment of the way some Ramsey County Judges disrespect Pro-Se litigants and collude with the City and County Attorneys. Oh, And the Ramsey County Sherrifs Office,
Jeff Matiatos
How about 1 more illegal without a drivers lic. hitting a school buses and maybe killing 15 and 20 badly hurt.
The the illegal just jumps the boarder and goes home.
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